Adventure card resolution

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Admrobbo

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Re: Adventure card resolution

Post by Admrobbo » Wed Jan 24, 2018 1:05 pm

Thanks for your replies.

I've found that the lifo timing rule was mostly quickly grasped by majority of folks I've played with, especially, as you say that it is really only a factor when one player wants to respond to action or card played by another.

I confess all my games thru playtesting and since receiving final version have been 2 player.

Will be interesting to see how this escalates in multiplayer games.

To get back to initiative, the two folks who raised the initial queries that I shared at start of this thread, were looking for turn order and initiative to be more fluid during a round, for reasons stated about timinf of adventure card scoring.

I find that the decision of playing first or second is a fun enough decision in the Ready phase.

A time is money up your sleeve adds spice to it.

Just to be clear with your intention... and I'll compare this to how I've taught it ...

When determining which captain has higher initiative, who gets to check first ?

Say in a 2 player game, Cap A has higher initiative based on ship and any other cards in play.

In stage 3 of ready phase the Cap with higher initiative chooses turn order. That would be Cap A in my example.

Cap B plays "time is money" to increase their initiative.

Cap A could respond by playing their own "time is money" and reducing Cap B initiative.

Cap B initiative would go down from latter played "time is money " then go up from their own played "time is money". Cap A would come out with higher initiative in this example.

However, what order would captains play their cards, who gets to play their card first?

The cap with the highest initiative before any card is played and before any turn order determined.. ..?

The query I was asked in a round about way was how is turn order of playing initiative altering cards in stage 3 of ready phase determined before initiative is consulted innthat stage to see which player gets to determine turn order.

I hope that makes sense!

Answer is probably obvious from rules, but I didn't have immediate answer.

I've taught it as the captain with highest "base" initiative from ship and other cards in play got to play cards first in this example.

Once this card pkayimf order initiative is resolved, Cap with highest initiative from ship and other cards, including impacts of multiple "time is money" cards , then chooses turn order as normal.

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Horizon Jeff

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Re: Adventure card resolution

Post by Horizon Jeff » Wed Jan 24, 2018 4:00 pm

Admrobbo wrote:
Wed Jan 24, 2018 1:05 pm
Thanks for your replies.

To get back to initiative, the two folks who raised the initial queries that I shared at start of this thread, were looking for turn order and initiative to be more fluid during a round, for reasons stated about timinf of adventure card scoring.

I find that the decision of playing first or second is a fun enough decision in the Ready phase.

A time is money up your sleeve adds spice to it.
This would have been a valid way to structure the game, and it would have greatly increased the value of :initiative. But at the same time, it would have introduced some headaches, and we opted for the simplicity of a single initiative determination for the round.


Admrobbo wrote:
Wed Jan 24, 2018 1:05 pm
When determining which captain has higher initiative, who gets to check first ?

Say in a 2 player game, Cap A has higher initiative based on ship and any other cards in play.

In stage 3 of ready phase the Cap with higher initiative chooses turn order. That would be Cap A in my example.

Cap B plays "time is money" to increase their initiative.

Cap A could respond by playing their own "time is money" and reducing Cap B initiative.

Cap B initiative would go down from latter played "time is money " then go up from their own played "time is money". Cap A would come out with higher initiative in this example.

However, what order would captains play their cards, who gets to play their card first?
So there's a few things to unpack here. In your current example, what would happen based on the play order you outlined is:

1. Cap B plays Time is Money. It goes on the queue.
2. Cap A plays Time is Money in response. It also goes on the queue. This is allowed because Time is Money, like all :event has :reaction timing by default.
3. Cap A's Time is Money resolves first, because it was last played, and Traveller uses LIFO timing. Thereby reducing B's :initiative.
4. Cap B's Time is Money resolves second, because it was played first., thereby increasing B's :initiative.
5. No further effects pending, the queue closes.

If nobody else does anything else, A's initiative remains higher, and they get to set the first captain.

Now, it's important also to appreciate that A could have played their Time is Money after B's resolved, rather than in response. In that case, the sequence would be:

1. Cap B plays Time is Money. It goes on the queue.
2. No other captain, including B, plays a :reaction.
3. Time is Money resolves, increasing B's :initiative.

THEN

1. Cap A plays Time is Money. It goes on the queue.
2. No other captain, including A, plays a :reaction.
3. Time is Money resolves, decreasing B's :initiative.

If nobody else does anything else, A's initiative remains higher, and they get to set the first captain.

Both of the above situations assumed that the captains were attempting to play their cards before determination of initiative order. But suppose for some reason, a captain wanted to play after that determination. Then the sequence would be as follows:

1. No captain wishes to generate an effect or play a card before determining initiative order. Therefore, Captain A as having the highest :initiative, may assign the first captain.
2. A assigns Captain B as first captain.
3. Captain B now plays Time is Money.

B would remain the first captain.
Admrobbo wrote:
Wed Jan 24, 2018 1:05 pm
The cap with the highest initiative before any card is played and before any turn order determined.. ..?

The query I was asked in a round about way was how is turn order of playing initiative altering cards in stage 3 of ready phase determined before initiative is consulted innthat stage to see which player gets to determine turn order.
According to Priority on page 24, during phase stages in which there is no acting captain, where two or more captains wish to play a card or generate an effect, priority goes to the captain with the highest :initiative.
Admrobbo wrote:
Wed Jan 24, 2018 1:05 pm
Once this card pkayimf order initiative is resolved, Cap with highest initiative from ship and other cards, including impacts of multiple "time is money" cards , then chooses turn order as normal.
This is correct. Once all effects have been resolved, then you figure out the resulting values and proceed with whatever is required in the stage.

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Re: Adventure card resolution

Post by AllanJR » Sat Jan 27, 2018 12:01 pm

Wait, do I have this right, re: Resolution?

There are Contracts and Complications, and they are each resolved in different Stages. Therefore if there were 2 ships attempting the same Contract and the higher initiative ship elected to go first that turn, regardless of how many complications began attached to the Contract, and that they were all cleared, the higher initiative ship would get first crack at completing the Contract, as Complications are resolved in one Stage and Contracts in the subsequent Stage. It does not alternate higher initiative then lower initiative, back and forth, digging out the Complications, until none are left, and then the next alternating turn could attempt the Contract.

Reread the rules, yep, "In Initiative order" within each stage. So first player can attempt all the complications in Stage 2, and then in Stage 3, the first player again gets to jump the Contract, effectively shutting out the second player, unless the second player has a nice Event to stymie the first player.

Admrobbo

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Re: Adventure card resolution

Post by Admrobbo » Sat Jan 27, 2018 1:13 pm

Thanks for your query. If I've understood your query.. ...

Both players get to resolve the contract if they were both eligible, even if one captain has a higher initiative. The card is not discarded until all pursuing eligible captains have attempted to fulfil it.

However, if more than one captain scores the contract, they each get one less point than the contract states, which could be zero.

The card is then discarded and the owner of that slot draws a new card.

It can therefore happen that one captain goes to trouble or removing all complications on a contract and bcomes eligible when non remain , whilst another captain who was pursuing the same contract may have no complications left to remove on their turn as the other captain removed them all, but they still become eligible to fulfil contract if they can.

That's just a bonus !

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Re: Adventure card resolution

Post by AllanJR » Sat Jan 27, 2018 8:11 pm

Oooh, doh! Yeah, I vaguely remember reading something about the -1 VP at one point or another.

Thanks. I was mulling over all the possible advantages of higher initiative based on my (incorrect) logic - so much for those plans.

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